What we have learnt in the past 2 days?
Hello All,
Apologies for not posting the week-end special (had it ready last week by the way). Just coming out from looong meeting where we looked at the things, discussed, shared views, and listed down things where we went wrong. Here is the snippet:
- Before going live allow all kinds of money transactions. (this would have pushed us to 7 Jan as the Pre-Order day, but this mess wouldnt be there then.)
- Have a page where you can enter address much before you can press BUY button. (the design team had suggested that you HAVE to write the address again on the Payment Page on CCavenue and this would cause a lot of repetition for use, passing address directly to their page has some security issues. Android Police suggested, that since we are not doing this, we are a scam. Hmmm)
- Anticipate demand and then open slow release. We can understand when one says that Apple is selling 100k devices in a day, but it was difficult for us to imagine that this could even be possible with us. Production is not limited to any component as much as it is to PQ. We are really pushing them hard. We have extremely high number of normal LCD panels available, and that wont even go out of production (total number of these panels manufactured runs into millions a months)
- Dont have short agreements! This is extremely weird suggestion and I will try to fight this till death. I have always found long agreements messy and incomprehensible, but it seems its best for business. In my last meeting our investors presented agreements from every other firm which had much worse terms, and no one knew, just because they were hidden somewhere in the long sea of texts or mentioned in nth url link.
- Notion Ink is right now too mysterious and needs to share everything about the product: Agreed, and accepted. Till CES we will spend our energy in the same.
- Involving everyone in the process of creation has its benefits and losses. No concrete decision made here (but I got hours of advice from everyone today, and I have only been in listening mode today)
The introspection has yet not ended, and we are learning. As we have said earlier, we are here to stay. Ups and downs are a part of any journey, but we will try to smoothen the process for anyone who is linked to us. My next goal is to make Notion Ink best in its customer relations and whole of my energy will go into making this happen. I would love to hear your comments and suggestions on this topic.
Warm thanks for those who still support, apologies to those who felt disappointed. But as of now seeking more strength.
Warm Regards
Rohan Shravan
Quite a paradoxical post name –> “What we have learnt in the past 2 days?”
I had been laughing about that every time I saw it as well!
As each day passes, I also am learnting a lot as well, how much of a train wreck this is becoming.
Someone find the fat lady and make her sing before the sun rises in Japan!
It is now sunday 19th in 11 different time zones and every where else it is saturday 18th!!
come on Rohan, we are all waiting. Just post an update so we know the current situation
sunday 19th in 12 time zones now!!
sunday 19th in 13 time zones now!!
9:00 am here in ny, usa. gotta go. taking my family out for breakfast. read you guys in a few hours. i’m sure will a great video (i’m happy with whatever he posts).
hey guys what time did rohan put the previous updates
Hey folks, i e-mail my friendly notion ink support guy whether i can get an Adam that supports t-mobile US 3G Bands and here what he said:
————————————————-
Dear Kam
Greetings from the Notion Ink Support Team!
You are right about the 3g bands. The Adam has two series – 850 / 900 and 900 / 2100. We have taken note of your request that you want the Adam to support the T-mobile 3g servie (2100).
The request model should be shipped to you.
Thank you for your continued support to Notion Ink!
Warm Regards
Jon
Notion Ink Support Team
————————————————–
basically i’m happy
Excellent! I want the same (T-Mobile over AT&T)!!!
I’m confused though about the frequencies used by T-Mobile. I *THINK* T-Mobile uses 1700/2100, but still not clear on what that means exactly.
I see the correlation to the “2100″ in your email above. What about the “1700″ part? Is that irrelevant? (ie: Are we sure it will work with T-Mobile?)
i wished i knew. i’m not a tech expert in this area. anyone else can enlighten us?
If you check out wikipedia:
en .wikipedia .org /wiki/ UMTS_frequency_bands
(please remove spaces for the link above)
If 850 / 900 and 900 / 2100 are the only 2 options…. then this probably means that “850 / 900″ mainly for US and “900 / 2100″ for rest of the world?
Regarding T-Mobile (I assume the 3rd paragraph/snippet below is relevant to what we need to know)…
The native T-Mobile network currently consists of 36,400 cell sites and predominantly uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band, making it the largest 1900 MHz network in the United States.
Data service is available to most users in the form of the older General Packet Radio Service (GPRS) or newer Enhanced Data Rates for GSM Evolution (EDGE). EDGE coverage is stated as being available within at least 75% of the GSM footprint.
3G service in the form of Universal Mobile Telecommunications System (UMTS) is available in most major markets. 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band, making most handsets sold by other US-based 3G UMTS/HSPA operators incompatible.
On the 5th of January 2010, T-Mobile announced that it has upgraded its entire 3G network to HSPA 7.2 Mbit/s which is an improvement from its previous peak of 3.6 Mbit/s.
T-Mobile also said that it plans to be the first U.S. carrier to deploy HSPA+ across its network by mid 2010. T-Mobile has finished HSPA+ trials in Philadelphia and has begun deploying HSPA+ across its network, HSPA+ is still available in Philadelphia. HSPA+ 21 service is now available to over 175 Million POPS
—
So if I want T-mobile support here in the US, I need 3G HSPA using the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band, right???
One more question for the T-Mobile experts… The main reason I am interested in T-Mobile is because of their “Mobile Broadband Passes”.
http:// www . t-mobile . com /shop/plans/prepaid-plans.aspx
I don’t plan to use 3G service all the time. I like the option of paying for 3G only when I need it (like if I ma going to go on vacation and want to be able to connect anytime/anywhere there is 3G coverage but not Wifi coverage). So I can pay $50 for 1GB of data that is good for up to 30 days on a T-Mobile Broadband Pass.
BUT… Now I wonder if those will even work with Adam. Will T-Mobile recognize that the Adam is not a smart phone and block it from accessing their data network?
I wish I understood all this 3G stuff and knew all my options with AT&T vs. T-Mobile (or possibly other providers) so I could make an educated decision…
Good info here
http:// www . phonescoop . com /articles/article.php?a=99&p=1493
It indicates that T-Mobile uses 1700 for the device to talk to the tower and 2100 for the tower to talk to the device. So the frequencies/bands are used in pairs for send and receive. So Adam would have to support both frequencies… right?
Grrrrr Too much to know and understand just to make a simple decision.
I think T-Mobile uses AWS 1700 (1700/2100) but I’m not sure if they also uses IMT 2100 (1900/2100). I hope NI has a clear understanding of what band T-MO uses.
I didn’t order the 3G model. You may want to double check with NI.
Greg,
In doing further research, it seems that T-Mobile supports 1700 for uplink and 2100 for downlink just like you said and if one is missing the connection will not be established.
“I do not know where you get your information from, but the USA G1′s frequency is not 2100mhz. It is 1700mhz. T-Mobile USA’s frequency is the AWS 1700/2100 band also known as UMTS1700. Europe’s band is 900/2100, also known as UMTS2100. The phone must be able to connect to uplink and downlink for it to be compatible on a network. Since his Nokia was UMTS2100 it could not connect to T-Mobile’s 1700mhz uplink frequency. Therefore, it is not compatible with T-Mobile USA’s 3G”
The above is an exchange from the T-Mobile forum and is a good read. Should help you out in your quest to find an answer to your question.
“http://forums.t-mobile.com/t5/Non-T-Mobile-Phones/3g-2100-mhz-compatible/td-p/127667″
Another snippet from Engadget might give you some relief it that is indeed true. A bit of a bummer as the uplink is at 3G speeds but downlink at 2.5G (i.e. EDGE). On my AT&T phone when it looses it’s 3G connection and switches to EDGE it becomes agonizingly slow.
“As expected, T-Mobile has provided full disclosure today on exactly what it plans to do with all that juicy spectrum picked up in this summer’s FCC auctions. Having been left out of the 3G race put on by its fellow national carriers, it comes as no surprise that T-Mobile has officially committed to rolling out UMTS / HSDPA on the 1700 and 2100MHz bands at a cost of some $2.1 billion. Unfortunately, the specrum is a few megahertz off from the UMTS 2100 used elsewhere, meaning existing 3G handsets designed to operate in Europe will be relegated to doing their 2.5G thing when roaming stateside;”
Link for above text “http://mobile.engadget.com/2006/10/06/t-mobile-details-3g-plans/”
Hope this helps
Besides the 8 GB Internal memory only (which can be bumped up with a microSD card), No trackpad (can live without for now), the 3G support for T-Mobile on the Adams is going to cause the most heartburn.
@inspironag
Do you know if T-Mobile will support Adam (since it is not a smart phone) on their “Mobile Broadband Passes” (pay as you go) data plans?
http:// www . t-mobile . com /shop/plans/prepaid-plans.aspx
So I’ve been on the phone with T-Mobile and AT&T today… With that said, I don’t know a whole lot more than I did before. Mainly because the carriers have not done much yet towards supporting data plans on 3rd party tablets and don’t have much info available for their customer support people.
I want a pre-paid data plan without a contract. I did not know AT&T offered that for the iPad. I thought they required a contract. If they offer the same for the Adam then AT&T will work for me just fine. BUT no one could confirm AT&T will offer the same pre-paid (no contract) plans for 3rd party tablets.
And there are a lot of unanswered questions regarding T-Mobile too…
As per prepaid Data plans, here is what I found for the two carriers in the USA (assuming they will be available for the Adam).
T-Mobile
100 MB (good for 7 days) $10
300 MB (good for 30 days) $30
1 GB (good for 30 days) $50
AT&T
250 MB (good for 30 days) $15
2 GB (good for 30 days) $25
(Note that AT&T will auto renew each month but can be cancelled at any time)
So base on cost and need, AT&T may even be better than T-Mobile.
I like the line that states “should” be shipped to you. LOL
@inspironag
Do you have a typo in your first message above?
It says “The Adam has two series – 850 / 900 and 900 / 2100″.
Should it have said “The Adam has two series – 850 / 1900 and 900 / 2100″?
The reason I ask is because I think that in the USA, AT&T uses both the 850 MHz (cellular) and 1900 MHz (PCS) bands. (I think they both send and receive in 1900)
So “850/1900″ makes more sense than “850/900″ in that respect… And in Europe carriers use 900 / 2100, which fits well into the theory of NI having two variants, one for US and one for Europe.
Now the problem for T-Mobile… I don’t think they use either of those frequency-band variants. They use AWS instead of PCS and send on 1700 and receive on 2100.
Heck, this gets more confusing every minute. But what I *think* is that the 900/2100 variant may not work in the US with T-Mobile. But I’m not sure.
So as of right now, I’m going to go with the default US variant and hope AT&T supports it with the same prepaid data plans they offer for the iPad…
I’m going to stop trying to figure it all out before my brain melts!
Greg,
AT&T transmits and receives on the same band for both 850 and 1900. So having support for one of these bands should work fine for AT&T 3G data network.
It is interesting that when 3G support was announced early on there were only two frequencies in play, 850 and 900.
Maybe the need to support T-Mobile brought in the other band, i.e. 2100 which may not be enough as it requires both 1700 and 2100 (uplink/downlink).
The ideal would have been 850/1900 and 1700/2100. This would have covered both AT&T and T-Mobile without any problems. Don’t know how that would impact the rest of the world.
AT&T used to run their 3G on 1900 but have been switching to running it on 850 due to its inherent benefits.
From AT&T FAQ – “http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pid=14003″
What is the difference between 850 MHz and 1900 MHz?
Much like an FM radio signal and an AM signal have different advantages, so do the 850 MHz and 1900 MHz frequencies. 850 MHz offers better in-building coverage because the signal can better penetrate walls than signals at other frequencies, while 1900 MHz is best for protection against interference with nearby sites.
Alright you!!! Divert your attention here!
What are your most wanted apps in the Adam?
Mine are:
1. An app that measures vibrations and jerks, and compensates for them on the screen, so that reading ebooks on bumpy roads is easy and strain-free
2. A port of Stellarium (http : // stellarium . org) to Android, with added functionality of getting the location from GPS and bearings from the digital compass and accelerometer, so that we can get a Google Sky Map-like functionality with great quality
3. A port of VLC to Android
Reply to my post, with the heading #Wishlist. Desist from commenting on others’ wishlists, and concentrate on your own.
Hopefully, someone will take notice and make the app for you.
right, so three things for this early morning saturday,
1. Quit yer bi-tc-hing, jeeze, it’s not like this is the shipping date, who cares if you have to wait till sunday to see the video(s)?what are you a bunch of drug abusers?
2. if you subscribe to email updates on this blog, they come in chronological order to your emailbox, so you can shut the f’up about the comments being out of order.
3. go kill 3 minutes and check this out: elderscrolls.com very cool, and you might notice there is a “pre-order now” link, but the release date is 11.11.11 so shut the f’up about NI doing preorders 30 days in advance, have you never bought a pre-ordered video game before?
lol agreed and we have more information about a product than I ever have before launch. Normally we only get leaks, glimpses, and an unofficial spec sheet.
I have been able to see videos of the pre-released video game. I also have a VERY big problem with being told we will do this on this day or time only to be constantly let down. Finndo, why don’t you let those of us who were not able to pre-order (like we were TOLD) complain in hopes of Notion Ink taking notice of the issues they are causing and not focus on all the fanboy comments that provide no real feedback.
The current time in Bangalore is
6:44 PM
I have forgotten the worst sort here in the blog. Therefore my post again.
The follower of the blog are knowing, that Rohan always posted his announced messages late in the night (banglador time). So you have to wait some more hours for the news(video).
Take a nap, play in the snow. No one will miss the video
The follower of the blog are knowing, that Rohan always posted his announced messages late in the night (banglador time). So you have to wait some more hours for the news(video).
Take a nap, play in the snow. No one will miss the video
It snows neither in Ecuador nor in Bangalore.
come on NI we are all waiting!
Ok can you please use a blog that is based on GMT, so everyone that posts, is organised, i cant even follow the thread as its all over the place
I am reading through Rohan’s interview on Android Police, and there are a lot of things on there that is making me very disappointed. And a lot of unanswered questions.
1: I remember very clearly, multiple occasions, that Rohan said there would be Android market support. Now he says there isn’t. What a bummer!!! The apps are one of the biggest part of the whole android experience. The thing about Market being only for phone is total BS, since most of the apps on there don’t have anything to do with phone functionality. Moreover, the Nook is getting an upgrade in January which will include Android Market access, and the Nook is only an e-book reader, not even a tablet. So what’s the real reason for not including Market access in the Adam? OK, anyway, so if/when Adam gets the gingerbread update, will we get Android Market access at least then?
2: No backside trackpad. This is a real crusher. It was such a cool feature. I am not sure why it was disabled. The reason is so vague, “mature solution” what does it even mean? it’s what we call a ‘non-answer’. If it is disabled, does it mean that a future firmware update will enable it, once they have worked out how to make it ‘more mature’?
3: There are 2 3G models, but why not just include a quad-band 3G chip? As an ‘unlocked’ device, it’s just a question of swapping out the Sim card to get data-service anywhere in the world. I live in the UK. I travel to the US a lot. I want to be able to get 3G access in both places. If there was a quad-band 3G chip, I could just use an ATT sim in the US and one of the UK carriers here. Why are there two separate dual-band 3G options instead of a single quad-band 3G? Why Rohan why?!!
4: So what exactly is the repair/warranty options for the Adam? Would I have to ship it somewhere in the world to get it fixed? Would I have to pay one-way or two-way shipping to get warranty service, and if so, what would that cost, I wonder. Where are these service centers located? Who runs them?
5: You said the box can be used as a stand. OK but what about a case to carry it around in? Will there be any cases available for the Adam? Or is it going to get all scratched and dirtied up in no time? For a ‘portable’ solution like the Adam, a good case is the first and most important accessory. If it doesn’t ship with a proper case, as it should, then where can we buy one?
~Aravind
Hey
A lot of people have voiced similar concerns and agree 8 Gb is pretty disappointing!
You can check out the new warranty guidelines at www. notionink. com/ warranty.php
That said, i hope to see the videos pretty soon, 18th is going to get over in a lot of places in a few hours!!!
It 18th in every country in the world(http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/custom.html?sort=2).
Video please!!
Ok, I made up my mind, before watching the video itself (it sucks to be in waiting mode all the time).
I have already paid INR 30000 and I don’t want to pay another INR 5000-10000 (possible custom duty) to get a 8 GB Adam tablet.
I know that 8 GB is still good enough for majority of users and we can always expand this with the help of microSDHC card or USB flash drives, this particular thing somehow annoyed me a lot.
I have sent a request to cancel my order ASAP and hope they will honor my request soon.
I am still interetsed in this product but I guess I can wait for a better spec’d option available in retail market in India where I can buy with out any worries. INR 40000 is not a small amount for me to gamble.
This is and was my first and last pre-order and I may not take this kind of risk in the future and it is really painful for the last few days, just keep waiting for more information from Rohan.
Something not very comforting with this whole process, I still want to have this tablet but the trust factor has come down a bit in me towards Notion Ink and I don’t want to be an early adopter and pay a premium for a product which looks like going to deliver less than original promise.
That just me, still wish this team all the best but no longer want to be a stakeholder in this saga.
Thank you for keeping me excited since CES 2010.
I hope that NI will give the chance of pre-order to someone else as I requested for canceling mine. I have ordered high end option (PQ + 3G) and I am sure many people would be interested in taking my slot.
I think for people from US, ADAM is still better device (if you can ignore the 3G band issue) as typically they don’t have to pay extra for custom duties and there is no conversion involved, i.e. they will pay exactly $600 for the higher end piece.
We, Indians, on the other hand, has to pay, extra $50 for the currency conversion and $100-$200 for custom duties.
Anyways, still waiting for the video as I still want to know what the software is capable of as well as quality of the build.
I got an email from NI that my cancellation is now complete, I am relieved.
I can go to bed now, with out any more waiting for the video. This is really embarrassing to wait for a video for almost a day. I will check tomorrow though, hopefully it will be there by then.
All the best to you all, hope you will be happy with the product.
Now it is 17.00IST , few hours left brother…wait…. . He will release video .
Hello Rohan
come a weekend-update today ?
He is coming with the video. still need weekend update?
I predict the new post with video demos will be up in 7 minutes!!
I predict the new post with video demos will be up in 8 minutes
Nostradamus you are not!
I recommend some James Randi.
What does Randi have to do with my “joke?”
———————————————— We want the updates by Hook-or-Crook ————————————–
Very Angry……..!!!! What is really going no?
18th December is almost over……………where are our updates.
We are despirate….this is just too much..plz! don’t test our patience!!
Your’s & our (Fanboys) credibility is at stake here…before they (Apple & others) call you a Vapor Ware or the most undeserving comment calling you a SCAM !!!…..
At last I got my order confirmed. Thanks. Well For india 3G variant should be 2100 band. Waiting for delivery now.:-)
It appears that we are still early, while its ending the 18th here in Australia my bros in the US are just getting up.
Hi Greg, I didn’t have to wake you, nothing’s happened yet.
I see we are still waiting…
I guess it is back to bed for now.
Good things come to those who wait? But I guess that wouldn’t justify us going on the pre-order bandwagon now would it. I had hopes the video would be posted by now…maybe when I come home drunk tonight it’ll be waiting for me…
hic… hic…
wazzat? weresavideo?
iz it comin soon?
ope so…
Wonder how deep the nesting goes?
Anyway, I’ve gotta go to bed but I suspect the video will appear right after I do, so for everybody else’s sake I’d better get out of here.
Bye, cya in a new world.
yes how deep does the rabbit hole go?
morning, afternoon, night folks,
after that interview, people should realise that, if anything, NI/Rohan are doing us a favor by bringing us the Adam despite all the limitations of Android 2.2 and restrictions from Google… once NI has enough money in the future they may decide to come up with their own OS with all the experience of Eden and Android tweaking…
and I loved that little snippet … Samsung Galaxy Tab is a phone
and we already know Adam is not a tablet… so giving us that next generation device when the other support structures are still behind in the evolution cycle
Well said. But the tease rohan is giving.. my my.. not for the weak heart. LOL.
its that time of the month again!!!
my F5 key’s starting to wear out…
interesting interview with AP!
3:39 Come on VIDEO, VIDEO, VIDEO!!!